Nicely put 'Nashua Mike'. I read the original poster regarding impeachment and though I didn't vote Republican I disagree completely with her just as I disagree with the original poster of this letter. We need to move on. Period.

A comment that the war on terrorism made Bush and Cheney wealthy seems more of an uninformed weak political remark taken out of context to be misinterpreted here as a slap to the military.

Growing up, I don't recall any veterans demanding a continuous display of gratitude and respect. Maybe some disgust was evident over those that had avoided the draft for various reasons, and it seemed to be mostly frustration over certain monetary gains made as a result of veterans not being present to take the opportunities.

The veterans I knew from WWII forward seemed to keep to themselves, sometimes telling their war experiences privately to fellow veterans in short conversations that quickly moved to their garden plans, etc. Any bits of information I was able to glean from my veteran relatives was supplied as more factual, rather than as a means of gaining my awe, respect, or reverence. These men and women seemed to be more tolerant of the fact that life was meant for living, enjoying their children, dealing with their visible and not so visible scars privately. Maybe they just loved their families so much, that we were protected from their pain. They always seemed happy to be with men and women that shared their experiences, saving those stories for each other.

I don't understand the quickness with which any opinion even remotely meant to disagree with war is immediately taken as an insult to veterans and current members of our military. I recall the reactions of my veterans to Nam protests geared more toward the laziness and waste of time on the part of the protestors. If anything, the veterans in my life found it insulting that they were asked to march in a parade, saying they thought they'd done enough marching. Don't know what I've missed, or why the change in expectations.

Maybe KraftyPat doesn't understand that one can be against the war, any war for that matter, yet still respect the efforts of our soldiers. (Just as some insist they will respect the presidential office, but not President Obama)

Yes our military is volunteer. Sign up with the military and agree to risk your life for a respectable living, an education, to be a part of something that could matter, maybe come out not feeling so much like one of life's losers. Signing on with the military isn't your typical at will employment, something to be understood since you will go where, and do what your orders demand until your time is up regardless of how your political views may change. College isn't an option for everyone.

Lets not blame the soldier this time KraftyPat, keep the blame on ourselves and the politicians allowed to make choices on our behalf. Saying our soldiers were duped is inappropriate, your personal opinion correct or not. Show some respect for the uniform please, and thank you.

"As many soldiers are just life's losers looking for a comfortable job, where they don't have to compete like in the private sector, as are some sort of special patriot."
It doesn't surprise me at all that someone who makes comments like this doesn't have the guts to enter his name. Whats your fear toughguy? Its amazing how brave some pathetic individuals can be when they have the cover of anonyminity. With your attitude Annoymous you aren't worth one single soldier even getting so much as a blister protecting your sorry duff. Lets me guess, somewhere in your life you tried to get into the military and now you live a life of bitterness because you just didn't have what it takes to get in!

thanks for your service for out country. Yes, you are 100 percent correct with your comments to Kraftypat. If it was not for my medical treatment after I returned from Nam also in 68 I would be gone from my life a long time ago. Yes it was "After" I returned. Why? because I was shocked and awed by the way I and my fellow troops were welcomed back home after fighting for our country with the flag burning and cussing out of our actions Those with Kraftypat's same outlook in this day and age do the same thing without the flag burning but always saying "We support our Troops".

I never said I support the war. What I feel doesn't matter one way or another. Less any of you forget we still have an all volunteer military. And the last time anyone cared to check the recruiters are not having any difficulty at all meeting their quotas. That tells me there are an awful lot of people out there who feel there is a reason to be there. Many of these kids are volunteering for second and third tours and if you took the time to try to get their opinion on things instead of just the biased media you just may find out you feelings just aren't very popular to the ones that really matter. I'm a Vietnam vet, 68 to 72, right in the thick of things. And I really don't care what you think of me. But I'll tell you what, why don't you spend a day at the airport or someplace military personnel are in abundance. And you can walk up to everyone one of them and say "Hi', I'm Pat Kraft and I think you've been duped"

Sure, telling it like it is on the war hurts the soldiers, empowers the enemy, what a load of crap.

As many soldiers are just life's losers looking for a comfortable job, where they don't have to compete like in the private sector, as are some sort of special patriot. Get over how valuable you think your are, the war is pointless waste of money and of no value to our security! Actually the war has made us less safe! So don't expect a hero's welcome!

The military may as well be working on a public highway construction if they want to do something for their country. Under the policies we have seen the last eight years joining the military HURTS our country's security.

PTSD: Post Traumatic Stress Disorder

A serious mental disorder which the current administration has only just acknowledged. I am only too familiar with how our government and the military chose to ignore the psychological wounds of their returning veterans. I don't trust any politician to carry through with promises to take care of returning soldiers. To have ignored the soldiers suffering from PTSD was an insult which doesn't carry any lofty principles connected to valor or love of our country. Without visible scars, PTSD was easy to ignore. I can only hope that future politicians will do right by warriors suffering from both mental and physical wounds this time around. Don't know if Obama promised it, but please put it on the list of the many items we hope to see accompolished in the next four years.

It is et al. not et al

excuse the typo...

I meant to say "real" ideas..

Nashua-Mike,

In that case we have the "inherent democratic right to question and challenge EVERY action of Obama from day one.

If Obama allows one 'no bid' contract to go to a group based on race or union affiliation then we have the right to go after him and it is 'fair' game.

A president who cuts the military and convinces the nation that we can negotiate while other nations develop and deploy real weapons of mass destruction, so that it brings terrorists to our shores, god forbid causes another 9-11 or worse with the idea of bringing some Utopian peace is also fair game.

So, Nashua Mike (and all of you other posters who I know will respond rudely to this post), know that most of us conservatives and moderates would love to set aside our partisan beliefs are ready for rational discussion but this impeachment crap is not brought forth by rational people, It is supported by hard Left kooks.

And also Mr. Nashua Mike, we would really honor our troops by bringing them home victorious and not sending a message to the world that our citizens are so soft and introspective that we are weak and unwilling to defend or protect ourselves.

One final comment. Most of us are willing to give an Obama administration the benefit of the doubt. I have been silent as I watch the demeanor and attitude of those who support Obama. However, it is quite apparent that Obama's election is not enough; progressives continue their 'my way or the highway' approach to agenda. That will only divide us and it is quite evident that winning was not enough for you folks.

If you truly want consensus, then the extreme thought on your side must stop. Otherwise this will devolve into a 'gotcha' kind of politics during an Obama administration and you will reap what you sow......more politics of personal destruction.

millennia ,

Can you for one moment put aside your hatred and stop with the ludicrous assertions and start discussing real issues?

Because this nation is in a world of hurt and we read ideas and not pointless and baseless adolescent rants.

All valid points Joe.

Wimmer, in her belief and blind allegiance, like so many others is reminiscent of those who followed Jim Jones.

Watch the MSNBC special on the People's Temple and Jim Jones and then tell me if that is not they same kind of belief and demeanor that many of the Obama supporters exemplify and demonstrate when Obama has not revealed who he really is at this point.

Ms. Wimmer and others will soon realize the need for a war on terror as they have forgotten 9-11.

The vets defended our freedoms by serving in Iraq, just not the freedom to speak critically of our government. Gotcha, Joe. Why don't we pass a lese-majesty law while we're at it to spare the hurt feelings of our volunteer men and women in uniform? Boo-hoo!

Our military have been used by Bush et al to give up their lives and suffer untold injuries (both mental and physical) to invade a sovereign nation that we had NO business invading. Bush et al should be not only impeached, they should be tried in The Hague for war crimes. And to add insult to injury, our military veterans often come home with PTSD, brain injuries, serious mental disorders and many of them are very hesitant to ask for help! It is a cultural issue for some, and a matter of pride for others. Many have come home to find their home is in foreclosure and to make matters worse, jobs are not to be had in many areas of this country. So they end up homeless. This is no way to treat our veterans. The best way we can support our military troops is to end Bush's Iraq adventure and bring our military troops home! This has nothing to do with our president-elect. It has everything to do with the duplicity of Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld et al. Our military troops have indeed died in vain. What a waste!

Obama has to clean up the mess the Bush administration is leaving this country in. The economy is so bad that some fear it will be more than a recession, and this happened on Bush's watch too. Our national debt is the highest it has ever been. The previous administration left a SURPLUS. This Bush administration spent not only the surplus, he spent your money, your grandchildren's money and very likely your great grandchilren's money!

An impeachment of Bush/Cheney would be a kindness! I would like to see them in jail for many years. There are now 4,200 dead in this war in Iraq. 4,200 families will never be the same again. There are untold civilian deaths of innocent people in Iraq which includes infants, children, elderly people, who certainly did not participate in this conflict. All those deaths are on the heads of Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, et al.
If you still support this invasion and occupation, you have been duped.

Pat Kraft

Joe, your request for the Obama supporters to make a list of just what "changes" Obama promised and possibly pass it along to those that did not support Obama is wonderful. Of course we will not see one word about it from the Obama supporters because they will want to cover it up and hide it so that in four years our voters can see just how much he kept his words, lots and lots of nothing but words from Obama.

Mr. Brandl,

As much as I think impeachment is a gross waste of time - considering all of the more important issues facing our nation - criticism of President Bush's and Vice-President Cheney's actions are not only fare game, but should not be seen by all loyal Americans as one's inherent democratic right to question and challenge the actions of their leaders.

Questions such as no bid contracts and ties to our Vice President, who ran one of the largest recipients of this largess is fair game.

A president who frightens a nation and world into believing in bogus weapons of mass destruction, so as to bring some sort of Wilsonian Democracy to Iraq, his while Osama Bin Laden is still loose with his cohorts active in Afghanistan is also fair game.

So Mr. Brandl (and all you other posters, who I know will respond angrily to this post), put aside you partisan differences and realize that the way we honor the service from our troops is to live as a true American and never fear rational discussion of our nation's policies. And also Mr. Brandl, we would further honor or troops by bringing them home to their freiends and family - unharmed.