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Letter: We must demand leadership on climate change

Katy Burns’s column, “A moving mass of deadly mud, then silence” (Sunday Monitor Forum, March 30), tells of the horrible mudslide that wiped out the tiny community of Oso, Wash., recently. At the end, she tells of the many slide warnings that had been issued in the past and the unabated building that continued, despite the dire warnings. Now, as the United Nations’ latest Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change report comes out, warning of the severe, pervasive and irreversible threats that humanity faces from unmitigated climate change (a threat we have the power to stem), one can’t help but wonder if the ongoing “climate silence” in Washington, D.C., will be awakened by a mass movement of citizens, rich and poor, demanding climate leadership. We can hope, and, better yet, call the White House at 202-456-1111.

ROGER SHAMEL

Hillsboro

Legacy Comments37

23 Global Warming & Climate Change Stories All Americans Should Read Before Earth Day http://www.ijreview.com/2014/04/128985-33-stories/

Can I comment?

In my testimony before the U.S. Senate I simply stated, “There is no scientific proof that humans are the main cause of the minor warming that has occurred over past 150 years.” This is why the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change uses the word “likely” when it states that humans are the main cause. This is a judgment (opinion), not a proof. If there was an actual scientific proof, they would write it down on a piece of paper and show it to us. - GREENPEACE FOUNDER - Patrick Moore

"According to a statement by Greenpeace, “Patrick Moore frequently portrays himself as a founder or co-founder of Greenpeace, and many news outlets have repeated this characterization. Although Mr. Moore played a significant role in Greenpeace Canada for several years, he did not found Greenpeace. After he left Greenpeace, Moore began work with the Nuclear Energy Institute front group, the Clean and Safe Energy Coalition. He has also worked for the mining industry, the logging industry, PVC manufacturers, the nuclear industry, and in defense of biotechnology. In October 2008, Greenpeace issued a statement distancing itself from Moore, saying he “exploits long gone ties with Greenpeace to sell himself as a speaker and pro-corporate spokesperson, usually taking positions that Greenpeace opposes.”[--DeSmogBlog

Well of course they would say that. Other organizations have done the same to members who have revealed the big hoax. Now online hoaxters with a political agenda based on controlling people through Draconian suggested laws and rules use this as a tool to push their ideology.

What "big hoax"? Provide documentation to support your claim--which I assert is fraudulent, and that you will attempt to back up (if at all) with "facts" from conspiracy-minded, far-right sites. That constitutes all the "proof" you need, and once again, will reveal how extreme are the views of those who make such claims.

Still waiting for documentation for your claim regarding "the big hoax".

What we should be wondering about more than climate change is stuff like the so called ring of fire, a chain of volcanos rimming the Pacific. Mt. St. Helens blew up decades ago now and those of us alive saw the effects. Now look at the city of Seattle, with Mt. Baker and Mt. Ranier nearby, both which are volcanos in the same chain. Geologists tell us it's not about "if", but instead it is all about "when". Yet we ignore this entirely. Climate change has happened throughout time. Though personally I think greenhouse gasses are in fact contributing to this issue, the fact is the northern polar cap on Mars has also melted away in recent decades, suggesting that this is an event thats mostly about solar system cycles and not simply the effects of man on our planet.

Any claims trying to link a shrinking ice cap on Mars to warming on our planet are spurious nonsense--which you should have looked up in real science sources, rather than relying on typical denier nonsense. Likewise, the statement that "climate change has happened throughout time" is another favorite claim of the deniers, implying either that there is nothing we can do about the present warming, or that we should simply lie back and enjoy it. Neither implication is true, as even a cursory investigation of the science will show. Climate change is real, human use of fossil fuels in the main cause, and we can solve this problem by switching to other sources of energy over the next 3 decades.

"real science" followers are those who find sites that agree with their view and call anyone who dares challenge the site "deniers". Reading is a necessary skill but believing everything you read and regurgitating it is kind of shallow. Please find those other sources of energy over the next three decades that will produce all of the necessary BTU's to maintain our current societal lifestyle and I will support your ideological cause which is about as close to a religion as the real thing.

Those interested in the science on an issue start by understanding the difference between the scientific findings and the deliberate distortions of those scientific findings by those with a vested interest in denying the truth.

There is no such thing as Globull Warming or Climate Change or whatever the alarmist money machine calls it theses days. The HOAX is up. It has now been 17 Years 8 months since globull warming has been indistinguishable from ZERO. Even the intelligent public polling show over 56% dont believe the alarmists anymore. We are in a peaceful era of lowest tornadoes, hurricanes, droughts. The public is smarter than this disproven HOAX

Yet again the made up mystery poll numbers. I did a search and only looked at the first two pages of listing. Not a single site backed up what your selling. Droughts, have you ever seen a national news show, kindly inform the people out west that this is a time of low drought conditions. I sometimes wonder if these oft quoted polls are just done to your family and pets?????

You need to do more diligent homework because BestPresidentReagan not only is correct, he actually UNDER rates the numbers from PEW RESEARCH (Oct 9-12, 2013): 44% believe any 'warming' is due to NATURAL factors, 26% believe there is NO SOLID EVIDENCE for global warming, and 13% believe it is just plain not happening at all. 18 26 13=57%, not 56. It appears that it is impossible to engage in an intelligent, informed, rational discussion on this matter with a global warming alarmist who somehow appear to act as if their own personal sense of self is threaten by anyone contesting the near-religious orthodoxy of their beliefs; a most revealing phenomenon for individuals who claim to be standing on 'science,' (so-called). you can

And they cherry pick from sites which are geared towards perpetuating the hysteria. That global warming alarmist is so certain and does more to harm credibility by posting page long diatribes that make reasonable people just turn off to the subject.

"Perpetuating the hysteria? The only ones on here in hysterics about the findings of climate science are you and the poster formerly known as Sail. Your posts routinely feature full-blown rants about how kicking the carbon habit will wreck the economy--while Sail's are the ones that cherry-pick facts from the actual scient to present misleading and distorted headlines. Last week's IPCC report actually put a price on what it would cost in terms of world-wide GDP to make the transition. It's far less than the costs of continuing to ignore the problem. We lack only the political will to make these changes.

Who finds relevance in the IPCC. East Anglia........that explains alot. "Oh my god, this is not good, our assumptions are really incorrect"

As usual, your post betrays the fact you've swallowed the Koch Brothers/ Big Coal lies hook, line and sinker. Your reference to the stolen emails bears no relationship to what actually transpired. Four different investigations cleared the scientists of ANY wrong-doing. Their private e-mails were stolen, words and phrases were taken out of context and given an invidious spin not present in the actual e-mails. Imagine what your emails might sound like were the odd phrase and word cobbled together to given the appearance of wrong-doing. Again, FOUR investigations-- each cleared the scientists at Hadley/CRUT. You are repeating, for the umpteenth time, lies and nonsense. And you do it for no pay, so completely hoodwinked are you by what you so want to believe is real--a vast conspiracy of scientists and bureaucrats, sapping the vital fluids of our economy. Because to believe otherwise would shatter so much of what you believe is good and "right' . Your trust is misplaced. You're being lied to. You have it almost exactly backwards.

IPCC IS A HOAX ......Award-Winning ..... Former UN....... IPCC Scientist Dr. Lennart Bengtsson Dissents: ‘We cannot yet separate well enough the greenhouse effect from other climate influences’ – Declares climate models ‘more a matter of faith than a fact.

No I beg to differ Bruce. As soon as I saw the headline I KNEW who would be posting on this article. Anyone that reads the comments knows you would. So in your honor Bruce I bid you the title "His Highness of the Most Alarmed and Hysterical Global Warming Perpetuators".

My posts consist of factual information on the science of climate change. If you have questions or wish to take issue with facts I post, feel free to state your case. As a rule, those who deny there is a problem are the ones who make astounding and hysterical claims--using distortions, exaggerations, and outright lies. For as long as I've been posting, correcting the misinformation and deliberate distortions of the Carp Per Diem Brigade, that's always been true. An objective reading of pertinent threads will prove that to the fair-minded reader.

The trouble is that the science is manipulated by ideology, politics and agenda. I might add that the distortions from the Carp Per Minutus brigade have been fast and furious lately. Fair minded? Nothing you post here is objective, it is copied and pasted material from websites you frequent to have a drink of the kool-aid.

One more time: You are confused and have it exactly backward. NONE of the claims made by deniers and reposted by you and sail come from science sources. Instead they come DIRECTLY from denier sources that actively manipulate the truth for their "ideology, politics, and agenda. Which is why both of you rarely post the links to the sources of fraudulent claims. My posts are either science sites or provide DIRECT links to the research supporting the statements I make.

Well, when I saw the headline, I knew the Lowness of Intelligent Thought would be posting at least ten times;

"Political will" - now that is a whopper supreme....... " When a politician says, concerning an issue involving science, that the debate is over, you may be sure the debate is rolling on and not going swimmingly for his side." What we lack is any proof that your HOAX is even a scintilla real.

Cherry pick my......... BPR and whoever brought up Pew and I went to their site. Not what I would consider cherry picking. I can't help it if neither can comprehend what they read. Besides - what hysteria?

The more recent Pew poll shows that two-thirds of Americans believe the climate is warming, and 44% attribute it to human activity. Not great numbers, but better than the poll you cite. http://www.pewresearch.org/key-data-points/climate-change-key-data-points-from-pew-research/

The latest Gallup poll released 11 days ago revealed that 40% believe in global warming and even less are worried about it. Moreover, and here is the quote, the majority of Americans identify the issue as political: "A major challenge facing scientists and organizations that view global warming as a major threat to humanity is that average citizens express so little concern about the issue. Many climate change activists have attempted to raise awareness in recent years, as evidenced by the recent U.N. report. Former Vice President Al Gore has been active in raising the alarm about the potentially disastrous impact of global warming, including in a documentary and a book. But the data at the national level show that none of this has changed Americans' worry about the issue in any lasting way -- perhaps reflecting the strong counter-position taken by many conservative thought leaders, and the "Climategate" controversies. A lack of formal education in general is clearly not a factor in Americans' failure to be more concerned about global warming; Americans who have not attended college are no less concerned than those with a college degree or postgraduate education. Politics are important in understanding American attitudes about global warming. The issue has become highly politicized in recent years, and that polarization shows up across a number of indicators" So keep on ranting and raving and being an extremist you are helping OUR cause.

Public opinion can be a fickle thing. The scientific data on global warming is a matter of belief--it's cold, hard facts. Had you polled southerners in 1960 about civil rights, what would you have found? Or polled Germans in 1935 about Hitler and his Reich? The deniers are using the same Big Lie tactics, as perfected by the tobacco lobby 40 years later: repeating lies and half-truths, to sow confusion and doubt. No amount of back-filling or counter-claims can change that fact.

Correction: My second sentence should read: "The scientific data on global warming is NOT a matter of belief..."

But your constant insistance can and does make people dismiss the hysterical, agenda filled ideological rhetoric as predictable as the fact that the sun will come up every morning.

Oh Mr. Expert, go the Pew web site and look up their latest info under energy and environment and your lie will become very transparent. I don't know which poll you and BPR are talking about. I notice that you both tend to reference fictional data. But on the Pew Research Site you will find this - "In a Pew Research Center survey conducted in October, two-thirds (67%) of Americans agreed there was “solid evidence” that the Earth is getting warmer, and 44% said human activity such as burning fossil fuels is the main reason. About three-quarters (74%) of those who said there is solid evidence believe it’s possible to reduce the impact of climate change." The issue is it is not seen as the biggest problem we face by the majority. It's not a case of faulty data, flawed data or made up data. It is because man as a species has very narrow tunnel vision. If they can see the problem, feel the problem they won't believe there is a problem. This is why man seldom learns from history and constantly relives it. I don't consider myself an alarmist, but what if at the end of the day, we are faced with actual global warming? Politics is not the best medium to address potential global climate problems, that's why we have scientist's.

this is what the so-called globull warming "scientists" produced... UN IPCC AR5 report infected with fatal technical and procedural flaws UN report’s fatal flaws destroy credibility of WGII and WGIII findings. HEADLINES: 1) IPCC Scientists Knew Data and Science Inadequacies Contradicted Certainties Presented to Media, Public and Politicians, But Remained Silent... 2)Rewriting Their Own Temperature Past At The National Academy Of Sciences: ‘Massively altered temp history since their 1975 report. 3) "The Green Movement has Red Roots." ~ George Will

Once more, the actual science behind each of your headlines does NOT support the claims those headlines make. ALL those purported "headlines" are from denier sites that distort and lie about the science. And George Will has been called out repeatedly for the inaccurate claims he has made whenever he writes about climate change.

Keep beating the drum, your rhetoric only appeals to those who believe as you do, you are preaching to the global warming choir. Their voices and yours are blending in with backgroud noise. No one is listening, you have over played your hand and people realize it. The drum beat is just becoming part of the landscape of extreme ideology. Thank you for deafening your own message and please keep up the diatribe, people will get sick of the same old song and dance.

HEADLINE: How did the IPCC’s alarmism take everyone in for so long? .... Climate scaremongers are still twisting the evidence over global warming ... http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/environment/climatechange/10746497/How-did-the-IPCCs-alarmism-take-everyone-in-for-so-long.html

good one

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